Comments on: NASA and ESA sign simple lunar exploration agreement

By: D. Messier

D. Messier — Tue, 27 Sep 2022 06:46:10 +0000

ESA is already a partner in Artemis. It’s supplying service modules for Orion and elements of the lunar gateway. Other partners include Canada and Japan. These are formal agreements worked out years ago.

The document NASA and ESA just signed says these are areas we’re cooperating in and could cooperate in in the future. Aschbacher can go to ministers and say these are other areas NASA is willing to work with us on, can you fund the following programs?

Agreement doesn’t commit either side to anything. Expanded cooperation is contingent on ministers approving ESA programs and negotiations with NASA.

By: GaryMike

GaryMike — Tue, 27 Sep 2022 05:16:17 +0000

“Allies” is an actual thing, even for us.

By: GaryMike

GaryMike — Tue, 27 Sep 2022 05:14:31 +0000

Europe knows it needs to remain relevant to gain access to solar system resources ($$$) in cannot obtain on its own.

By: Edward

Edward — Mon, 26 Sep 2022 23:49:50 +0000

D. Messier wrote: "I doubt it has anything to do with the Artemis Accords."

In a Sept. 23 statement, NASA described the agreement as a “non-binding joint statement” about current and prospective future cooperation in Artemis.

Since cooperation in Project Artemis requires being a signatory to the Artemis Accords, then NASA has described the agreement incorrectly.

Aschbacher mentioned both the European Large Logistics Lander and Moonlight in comments at a heads-of-agencies panel at the conference Sept. 18, saying that, if funded, they could be developed “in exchange for astronaut flights,” something he added was yet to be negotiated with NASA.

Clearly, Aschbacher expects ESA participation in Artemis. From Wikipedia:

The Artemis Accords are a series of bilateral agreements between the United States government and other world governments participating in the Artemis Program, ...

Bridenstine stated that the agreements were intended to create a uniform set of guidelines for countries to avoid potential conflict or misunderstanding in future space endeavors; governments that sign the Accords may formally take part in the Artemis Program.

Since signing the Accords is required to formally take part in the Artemis Program, it seems that ESA's part must be informal. Unless this agreement is NASA's way of getting around the signature requirement, in which case this has much to do with the Artemis Accords as a workaround to signatory status.

By: D. Messier

D. Messier — Mon, 26 Sep 2022 21:40:13 +0000

The Space News story mentions that it will help ESA to prepare for the upcoming Ministerial Meeting in November where priorities are set and programs approved by representatives of ESA member nations. It gives the ESA Director General more leeway to propose additional elements to the existing cooperation to the ministers.

I doubt it has anything to do with the Artemis Accords.

By: Richard M

Richard M — Mon, 26 Sep 2022 17:59:27 +0000

I suspect this short one page agreement is the Biden administration’s under-handed admission that — when it comes to Europe — the Artemis Accords will no longer be required.

Quite possibly. But the Biden Administration is not likely to be in power when any of these notional missions will fly anyway.

It could also be that there will end up being multiple “tiers” to participation in Artemis.