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	Comments on: Rocket Lab provides detailed update on successful recovery of first stage after splashdown	</title>
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	<link>https://behindtheblack.com/behind-the-black/points-of-information/rocket-lab-provides-detailed-update-on-successful-recovery-of-first-stage-after-splashdown/</link>
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		<title>
		By: Edward		</title>
		<link>https://behindtheblack.com/behind-the-black/points-of-information/rocket-lab-provides-detailed-update-on-successful-recovery-of-first-stage-after-splashdown/#comment-1096463</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Edward]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2020 05:15:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://behindtheblack.com/?p=71296#comment-1096463</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Ray Van Dune, 
You wrote: &quot;&lt;i&gt;... that the essential system to reverse the booster’s trajectory and arrest its descent, the main engines, are already well-engineered for the job, being able to resist intense heating and very high forces by virtue of their core function, propulsion of a million-pound vehicle to hypersonic speeds!&lt;/i&gt;&quot; 

Please do consider the other systems that are not already subjected to the same (external) heating and pressure during launch.  There is the plumbing, for instance.  Even the engines depend upon some amount of cooling during launch, which they don&#039;t get during reentry.  The Merlins and Raptors would have had to have been designed with these extra problems in mind.  Even Rocket Lab&#039;s engine compartment would have been designed with these considerations.  The engines, fuel tank dome, and other items may be a bit heavier than they could have been otherwise, but reusability always required tradeoffs that one-and-done didn&#039;t need. Probably a reason why many engineers believed that reusability was impractical.  

&quot;&lt;i&gt;I wonder if even the barge could be eliminated by landing on a convenient island?&lt;/i&gt;&quot; 

Although this sounds good, the reality is a bit different.  The flights generally do not go in the direction of islands.  Most will fly due east, some seem to be going south (where there may be some islands available, maybe), and ISS missions go toward the north.  

Return by barge, from an island landing, is the most likely method, as airplanes are usually only cost effective in delivering payloads to the launch site in a timely manner.  Equipment returning from the launch site generally takes the slow but cheap routes, as time is no longer of the essence.   

Sorry about your dream of seeing an AN-225 carrying a Falcon booster.  That would have been a good sight and picture.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ray Van Dune,<br />
You wrote: &#8220;<i>&#8230; that the essential system to reverse the booster’s trajectory and arrest its descent, the main engines, are already well-engineered for the job, being able to resist intense heating and very high forces by virtue of their core function, propulsion of a million-pound vehicle to hypersonic speeds!</i>&#8221; </p>
<p>Please do consider the other systems that are not already subjected to the same (external) heating and pressure during launch.  There is the plumbing, for instance.  Even the engines depend upon some amount of cooling during launch, which they don&#8217;t get during reentry.  The Merlins and Raptors would have had to have been designed with these extra problems in mind.  Even Rocket Lab&#8217;s engine compartment would have been designed with these considerations.  The engines, fuel tank dome, and other items may be a bit heavier than they could have been otherwise, but reusability always required tradeoffs that one-and-done didn&#8217;t need. Probably a reason why many engineers believed that reusability was impractical.  </p>
<p>&#8220;<i>I wonder if even the barge could be eliminated by landing on a convenient island?</i>&#8221; </p>
<p>Although this sounds good, the reality is a bit different.  The flights generally do not go in the direction of islands.  Most will fly due east, some seem to be going south (where there may be some islands available, maybe), and ISS missions go toward the north.  </p>
<p>Return by barge, from an island landing, is the most likely method, as airplanes are usually only cost effective in delivering payloads to the launch site in a timely manner.  Equipment returning from the launch site generally takes the slow but cheap routes, as time is no longer of the essence.   </p>
<p>Sorry about your dream of seeing an AN-225 carrying a Falcon booster.  That would have been a good sight and picture.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Ray Van Dune		</title>
		<link>https://behindtheblack.com/behind-the-black/points-of-information/rocket-lab-provides-detailed-update-on-successful-recovery-of-first-stage-after-splashdown/#comment-1096389</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ray Van Dune]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Dec 2020 16:10:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://behindtheblack.com/?p=71296#comment-1096389</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve not heard it mentioned before, but it seems as though SpaceX discovered a happy synergy that others overlooked, probably because they weren&#039;t searching for it... that the essential system to reverse the booster&#039;s trajectory and arrest its descent, the main engines, are already well-engineered for the job, being able to resist intense heating and very high forces by virtue of their core function, propulsion of a million-pound vehicle to hypersonic speeds!

Of course, the next logical step was to eliminate the &quot;reverse the booster&#039;s trajectory&quot; part, by stationing a landing pad at sea along the path the booster would take anyway, were it being thrown away like everyone else&#039;s are! Barges are a lot easier to build than rockets!

I wonder if even the barge could be eliminated by landing on a convenient island? Bermuda? Someplace in the Windward chain? How to get it back? An AN-225 might do it, or just plug in a nosecone and fly it back?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve not heard it mentioned before, but it seems as though SpaceX discovered a happy synergy that others overlooked, probably because they weren&#8217;t searching for it&#8230; that the essential system to reverse the booster&#8217;s trajectory and arrest its descent, the main engines, are already well-engineered for the job, being able to resist intense heating and very high forces by virtue of their core function, propulsion of a million-pound vehicle to hypersonic speeds!</p>
<p>Of course, the next logical step was to eliminate the &#8220;reverse the booster&#8217;s trajectory&#8221; part, by stationing a landing pad at sea along the path the booster would take anyway, were it being thrown away like everyone else&#8217;s are! Barges are a lot easier to build than rockets!</p>
<p>I wonder if even the barge could be eliminated by landing on a convenient island? Bermuda? Someplace in the Windward chain? How to get it back? An AN-225 might do it, or just plug in a nosecone and fly it back?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Brad		</title>
		<link>https://behindtheblack.com/behind-the-black/points-of-information/rocket-lab-provides-detailed-update-on-successful-recovery-of-first-stage-after-splashdown/#comment-1096314</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brad]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Dec 2020 23:30:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://behindtheblack.com/?p=71296#comment-1096314</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[David,

I do think it is an interesting coincidence that the Falcon 9 and the Electron rockets share a similar engine arrangement, with 9 engines in the 1st stage, and one vacuum optimized engine in the 2nd stage!  So it&#039;s no surprise the burn time for the first stages are also similar, 152 seconds for the Electron and 180 seconds for the Falcon 9 (according to Spaceflight101 website).  

That burn time for the Falcon 9 may be a little deceiving, since any recovery of the first stage requires eating into the burn time by a significant margin.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David,</p>
<p>I do think it is an interesting coincidence that the Falcon 9 and the Electron rockets share a similar engine arrangement, with 9 engines in the 1st stage, and one vacuum optimized engine in the 2nd stage!  So it&#8217;s no surprise the burn time for the first stages are also similar, 152 seconds for the Electron and 180 seconds for the Falcon 9 (according to Spaceflight101 website).  </p>
<p>That burn time for the Falcon 9 may be a little deceiving, since any recovery of the first stage requires eating into the burn time by a significant margin.</p>
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		<title>
		By: David Eastman		</title>
		<link>https://behindtheblack.com/behind-the-black/points-of-information/rocket-lab-provides-detailed-update-on-successful-recovery-of-first-stage-after-splashdown/#comment-1096278</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Eastman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Dec 2020 16:50:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://behindtheblack.com/?p=71296#comment-1096278</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I know that the SpaceX Falcon 9 has a somewhat unconventional balance between the booster and upper stage, with the upper stage being larger than usual so that the staging occurs earlier in the flight, making the booster recovery easier. I wonder if the same is true for the Electron, or if they&#039;ve succeeded in recovering a booster from a higher and faster point in the trajectory.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know that the SpaceX Falcon 9 has a somewhat unconventional balance between the booster and upper stage, with the upper stage being larger than usual so that the staging occurs earlier in the flight, making the booster recovery easier. I wonder if the same is true for the Electron, or if they&#8217;ve succeeded in recovering a booster from a higher and faster point in the trajectory.</p>
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