Woman scares off attackers with gun
The right kind of gun control: An Ohio woman with a concealed carry license scared off two bat-wielding attackers when she pointed her gun on them.
This is not that unusual a story but I wanted to highlight it because of this quote:
The men took off and so far have eluded police. Dinah posted about the incident on Facebook to alert friends and neighbors, to criticism by some. “Most of the males’ opinion was, ‘Why didn’t you shoot them?'” [emphasis mine]
The highlighted quote above, nonchalantly advocating that she should have fired the gun, is incredibly stupid. Life is not a modern Hollywood movie, where idiots shoot their weapons indiscriminately without thought. This woman made exactly the right decision. She used her weapon to stop the attack, and then proceeded on her way. Had she fired she would made things very messy for herself, for no reason.
Guns in the hands of good people are without question the best defense against bad people. However, if you use that gun unwisely or without cause you make yourself a bad person. Stay good and stay safe. Arm yourself, but don’t use your weapon unless you really really really have to.
Readers!
Please consider supporting my work here at Behind the Black. Your support allows me the freedom and ability to analyze objectively the ongoing renaissance in space, as well as the cultural changes -- for good or ill -- that are happening across America. Fourteen years ago I wrote that SLS and Orion were a bad ideas, a waste of money, would be years behind schedule, and better replaced by commercial private enterprise. Only now does it appear that Washington might finally recognize this reality.
In 2020 when the world panicked over COVID I wrote that the panic was unnecessary, that the virus was apparently simply a variation of the flu, that masks were not simply pointless but if worn incorrectly were a health threat, that the lockdowns were a disaster and did nothing to stop the spread of COVID. Only in the past year have some of our so-called experts in the health field have begun to recognize these facts.
Your help allows me to do this kind of intelligent analysis. I take no advertising or sponsors, so my reporting isn't influenced by donations by established space or drug companies. Instead, I rely entirely on donations and subscriptions from my readers, which gives me the freedom to write what I think, unencumbered by outside influences.
You can support me either by giving a one-time contribution or a regular subscription. There are four ways of doing so:
1. Zelle: This is the only internet method that charges no fees. All you have to do is use the Zelle link at your internet bank and give my name and email address (zimmerman at nasw dot org). What you donate is what I get.
2. Patreon: Go to my website there and pick one of five monthly subscription amounts, or by making a one-time donation.
3. A Paypal Donation or subscription:
4. Donate by check, payable to Robert Zimmerman and mailed to
Behind The Black
c/o Robert Zimmerman
P.O.Box 1262
Cortaro, AZ 85652
You can also support me by buying one of my books, as noted in the boxes interspersed throughout the webpage or shown in the menu above.
The right kind of gun control: An Ohio woman with a concealed carry license scared off two bat-wielding attackers when she pointed her gun on them.
This is not that unusual a story but I wanted to highlight it because of this quote:
The men took off and so far have eluded police. Dinah posted about the incident on Facebook to alert friends and neighbors, to criticism by some. “Most of the males’ opinion was, ‘Why didn’t you shoot them?'” [emphasis mine]
The highlighted quote above, nonchalantly advocating that she should have fired the gun, is incredibly stupid. Life is not a modern Hollywood movie, where idiots shoot their weapons indiscriminately without thought. This woman made exactly the right decision. She used her weapon to stop the attack, and then proceeded on her way. Had she fired she would made things very messy for herself, for no reason.
Guns in the hands of good people are without question the best defense against bad people. However, if you use that gun unwisely or without cause you make yourself a bad person. Stay good and stay safe. Arm yourself, but don’t use your weapon unless you really really really have to.
Readers!
Please consider supporting my work here at Behind the Black. Your support allows me the freedom and ability to analyze objectively the ongoing renaissance in space, as well as the cultural changes -- for good or ill -- that are happening across America. Fourteen years ago I wrote that SLS and Orion were a bad ideas, a waste of money, would be years behind schedule, and better replaced by commercial private enterprise. Only now does it appear that Washington might finally recognize this reality.
In 2020 when the world panicked over COVID I wrote that the panic was unnecessary, that the virus was apparently simply a variation of the flu, that masks were not simply pointless but if worn incorrectly were a health threat, that the lockdowns were a disaster and did nothing to stop the spread of COVID. Only in the past year have some of our so-called experts in the health field have begun to recognize these facts.
Your help allows me to do this kind of intelligent analysis. I take no advertising or sponsors, so my reporting isn't influenced by donations by established space or drug companies. Instead, I rely entirely on donations and subscriptions from my readers, which gives me the freedom to write what I think, unencumbered by outside influences.
You can support me either by giving a one-time contribution or a regular subscription. There are four ways of doing so:
1. Zelle: This is the only internet method that charges no fees. All you have to do is use the Zelle link at your internet bank and give my name and email address (zimmerman at nasw dot org). What you donate is what I get.
2. Patreon: Go to my website there and pick one of five monthly subscription amounts, or by making a one-time donation.
3. A Paypal Donation or subscription:
4. Donate by check, payable to Robert Zimmerman and mailed to
Behind The Black
c/o Robert Zimmerman
P.O.Box 1262
Cortaro, AZ 85652
You can also support me by buying one of my books, as noted in the boxes interspersed throughout the webpage or shown in the menu above.
I feel she should of shot the 2 attackers! These 2 may go on to rob and “kill” their next potential victim!
You obviously don’t own a gun, or shouldn’t if you do. Carrying a weapon means carrying a responsibility. It doesn’t make you judge, jury, and executioner, as you would like.
It was not her job to kill these assailants. Her job was to prevent any violence against her person. She did so quite admirably.
Even if she was fully in the right, it would have been incredibly dumb to shoot those men if she didn’t have to. In most this country the legal system is set up against a person who defends themself with deadly force. The local DA would, more likely than not, have made her life hell for the next year as the threat of a prison sentence loomed over her. Then more so if the attacker were of a protected racial class (which they weren’t in this case).
She sounds like a very smart cookie. She had the foresight to carry a weapon, used it to the degree necessary to protect herself, and didn’t do anything unnecessary that would have caused her a great deal of grief.
As long as her assailants had weapons she should be safe.
Around here whipping out a gun to scare off someone could be considered brandishing or threatening with a deadly weapon. And could send you to jail and remove your gun rights.
It all depends on the prosecutor.
But as more and more states adopt CC laws more and more prosecutors are having trouble sending people to court for holding a gun in public.
In my opinion, when you choose to draw your weapon, you have made a choice to USE the weapon. If you are threatened with ‘deadly force’ you should meet that with deadly force. I have a CC permit as does my Wife we BOTH carry on a regular basis. If I make the decision to draw my weapon I WILL USE IT… Saying someone is either smart or foolish for drawing their weapon is stupid. She did what she did. As such I can only hope that the fools that picked her as a target don’t see her not shooting as a weakness and decide to visit her again… Speaking for myself, “I’d rather be judged by 12 then carried by 6″…
Andrew Branca, author of “the Law of Self Defense” wrote a great synopsis of whether ‘armed’ matters vs ‘unarmed’ in self defense cases.
As usual, it is not as simple as anyone thinks.
http://legalinsurrection.com/2014/08/why-use-of-a-gun-can-be-lawful-even-against-an-unarmed-person/
Get his book if you own a gun, or are serious about self defense. You need to know what you are allowed to do, and how you can protect yourself legally if g-d forbid you ever have to defend yourself physically.
(Also read Andrew’s day by day account of the Zimmerman trial. And check his regular updates on current “Self Defense” cases with legal analysis.)
No one is suggesting that anyone should drawn a gun without the intent to use it. Of course you should be prepared to fire whenever you draw your gun. What I am noting is the importance of a law-abiding gun-holder to avoid escalating the situation unnecessarily, as my concealed carry instructor repeatedly emphasized.
As soon as those attackers fled the incident ended. To fire then would have placed this woman in serious legal circumstances that would have threatened her future just as much as the attack itself.
If by using a weapon, you mean firing it, whenever you pull it out then it really scares me that you have a concealed carry permit. This woman did use her weapon. She made it clear that she was carrying the weapon and then made it clear she was willing to fire the weapon. That was apparently enough to stop the attack and de-escalate the situation. Do you honestly advocate that she should have then fired the weapon at the men for the hell of it? How would this have helped her beyond what she had already done for herself?
I can think of dozens of situations where a weapon could be drawn by a simple misunderstanding, let alone situations which quickly de-escalates as in this instance. Do you seriously advocate that a weapon being withdrawn is reason enough to pull the trigger? You really should think this through as you sound like someone twisting principles to justify a deep itch to simply shoot another person.
A person should never draw a gun out unless they are willing to kill with it.
As was explained to me during my CCW course. You NEVER bring it out to intending to threaten, scare or wound. Never.
A wound does not stop the attack. As evidenced by the recent shooting were the 300 pound man was shot several times and still kept advancing on the officer. He only stopped advancing when dead(shot in the head).
You do not draw it intending to threaten someone. This is just another chance for your weapon to accidentally fire and kill the wrong person. Or for you to lose control of the weapon. Do you really think you could have fought off that 300 pound 6 foot 4 inch angry man with one hand while your other hand is trying to hold onto your gun?
And never bring it out intending to intimidate or scare someone away. Like off your property. Sorry but thats just asking for charges to be filed against you for threatening or intimidating with a deadly weapon.
If you bring it out you best intend to use it. And if you do not use it, you better be prepared to explain yourself to the cops.
The excuse “I just wanted to scare them away” is no longer acceptable in court. If it ever was.
When you accept and take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm you accept the fact that now you MUST protect that weapon at all costs. You can never let it fall into the hands of a bad guy, ever, for any reason.
Any strike to you could render you unable to protect and use that weapon. And if you can’t use it, the bad guy will. He will take it and shoot you with it, then shoot the next guy with it. You can not guarantee that the bad guy will not take that gun.
Never pull it out unless your fully willing to kill with it. This is not the practice range or the movies.
Why does that scare you MPThompson?
It should scare you more that someone is willing to harm you for a few bucks, your shoes, your car or just for fun.
Don’t fear the guy protecting himself but fear the guy who intends to do you harm.
You are making straw man arguments. Neither I nor mpthompson have been saying that you should not have the intent to kill when you draw your weapon. Of course you must have that intent.
Our worry with Matt is that he seems to think that because you have drawn your gun you MUST fire it. That is not only silly, it is very dangerous. To be prepared to fire is required. To fire automatically could end up having you kill someone by mistake, or in circumstances that were unnecessary.
Any competent conceal carry instructor is going to teach this.