Conscious Choice cover

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Conscious Choice: The origins of slavery in America and why it matters today and for our future in outer space, is a riveting page-turning story that documents how slavery slowly became pervasive in the southern British colonies of North America, colonies founded by a people and culture that not only did not allow slavery but in every way were hostile to the practice.  
Conscious Choice does more however. In telling the tragic history of the Virginia colony and the rise of slavery there, Zimmerman lays out the proper path for creating healthy societies in places like the Moon and Mars.

 

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Data Scientists: Outright fraud in Georgia election

Below is the testimony this week in front of the Georgia state senate from three data scientists analyzing the Dominion computer systems and the November 3rd raw vote tally data. Watch it, please. As one of the three scientists bluntly said,

There was fraud in Georgia’s election. We can prove it with data. and because we can prove it with data the voting will of the voters of Georgia is not reflected in what was certified by the secretary of state.

They found three very shocking facts. First and most important, in a system that should only be tabulating votes, so that the numbers only go up, they found more than forty examples where the numbers for Trump went down. As another scientist noted, “There is no reason that at any point that something should be subtracted.”

Worse, they also found that Biden’s numbers would then go up at the same time, by the exact same amount. The total votes affected exceeded 200K.

In other words, votes were being switched.

Second, they found that the computer system too easily allows a human access to the data, and worse, permits that human to make wholesale changes, with no oversight. Their testimony confirmed previous video evidence by one election supervisor in other testimony.

Third, they found that the Dominion system was specifically designed to destroy the original ballot whenever that ballot was reviewed and its vote adjusted or changed by that human. This means that any later audit is worthless, as it cannot go back and compare the original vote with the final software vote.

I found out about this particular testimony from a report by Dilbert cartoonist, Scott Adams, who after watching it concluded, “Looks like Trump won.”

After this and other testimony, including another computer expert who during the testimony was able to hack into the Dominion systems presently tabulating on-going polling for the senate, even though we have been told this was impossible, it is very clear that the results from the Georgia November election are untrustworthy, likely fraudulent.

At a minimum they must be reviewed entirely. More properly, they should be decertified.

This evidence also raises legitimate questions about the totals tabulated by Dominion machines in any other state.

Readers!
 

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100 comments

  • jburn

    I’m gobsmacked, but refuse to be defeated by these demons in the democrat party.

  • Max

    A blast from the past, a long time ago, just last year. Where did the money come from to buy off so many voting systems?
    The why:

    “A 2019 report on findings from the annual DEF CON Voting Village, where hackers attempt to break into voting machines, found new vulnerabilities. The report said participants “were able to find new ways” to compromise “every one of the devices in the room in ways that could alter stored vote tallies, change ballots displayed to voters, or alter the internal software that controls the machines.”

    The solution that fixed everything:

    “According to the EAC, the $380 million for election security approved by Congress in 2018 is mostly being used by states to replace outdated voting machines and to upgrade cybersecurity services. Palmer will testify that these funds were “critically important to helping officials secure election infrastructure.”

    “Davis, who has introduced election security legislation, will also highlight the $425 million given to states for election security as part of the 2020 appropriations package”

    A typical bait and switch by our own government. Your money well spent. These are the results which show incompetence of the highest order… Or the sabotage/overthrow of democracy and the American way. Authorized by the very people who were there to prevent it!

    https://thehill.com/policy/technology/477455-voting-machine-vendors-to-testify-on-election-security

    Before Trump leaves office, his last directive should be to install dominion voting computers in the house and senate for all future congressional votes.
    What’s good for the goose… (In this way, the lobbyist can buy their votes directly from the Computer I.T. guy?)
    Somewhere, Comrade Stalin, chairman Mao, Karl Marx and Lennon, Pol pot, Castro and Hugo Chavez are all smiling…

  • Mitch S.

    While it’s vital to gather and preserve data from the Nov election, Republicans are ignoring the immediate danger – next week’s Georgia senate election.
    Forget the computer nerds, Krackens, Golems, etc. Where is the army of workers and volunteers trained and equipped to monitor this election?
    Lose the Senate and it’s over.

  • Cotour

    The governor of Georgia should be forced by the legislature to postpone the election until it can be guaranteed secure.

    Because it has in real time been established that it is NOT secure and there is early voting under way. Who anywhere would expect a different result? “What do you know, the Socialist Democrats won!”

    And those 6 states in question should have a revote.

    I have said this before, if it were not for cheat, fraud and out right corruption there would be few and far between Democrat party elected officials in America. They must cheat to win. And they do.

  • Cotour

    Speak not about corruption in elections in America if you are the president unless you can prove it, even though you know its true. “Its irresponsible”, it threatens the stability of the country.

    https://youtu.be/4ZtTUe95PkM 2 min.

    We know there is corruption and fraud in elections we know it and the government knows it but the government never seems to properly investigate the situation. I think an example of the fox watching the hen house.

    “POLITICS: THE DIRTIEST, FILTHIEST MOST CORRUPT GAME THAT HUMAN BEINGS PLAY”

    Why not put the FBI on the case? No wait, not the FBI, thats not a good idea, remember Comey and all that? Why not have state police under the states governors authority investigate? No wait, thats also not a good idea either, the governors are creatures of politics and are obligated.

    I guess we all just going to have to live with the fact that there is fraud and corruption in our elections and that is it, no one can do anything about it. And those who cheat in elections win.

    (Now is that any way to run what is suppose to be the “BEST” government, the “BEST” Democracy on the planet? Fraud is a word that can be spread around in a lot of places on this planet)

    And why is all of this accepted? Because it the power to remedy all of this is in the hands of and in control of one group of people, the voters themselves. And that is the truth of the matter.

  • mpthompson

    I guess we all just going to have to live with the fact that there is fraud and corruption in our elections and that is it, no one can do anything about it. And those who cheat in elections win.

    Such a state of affairs is doomed to failure. Of course, our enemies, both foreign and domestic, are well aware of this.

  • Cotour

    It is the paradox that is America. We live in an open Democratic society immersed in certain degrees of personal freedom, and the ultimate twist? We invite all our enemies into our country to participate in it.

    Make sense to you?

    The only solution?

    The Constitution.

    Only in America.

  • Alex G

    Election fraud has always existed in this country to one degree or another. This time was different. It’s been institutionalized and the media now colludes with those who manipulate the results, all to achieve an outcome they view as in the best interests of us fools out here. We may have passed a tipping point where the only way to clean this mess up is by violence.

  • Chris

    To me (adding to Alex G et al.) the true thing to note is the overwhelming SILENCE of the main stream media on this and the other overall “story” that the Trump team has no evidence to prove any fraud. Anyone who only uses this media is duped by them and therefore outraged by “outside” stories of anything than the narrative.
    This is the coup or at least a major part the coup.

  • Andrew_W

    I didn’t see anything there that addressed the hand recount, all these claimed irregularities would only affect the electronic count, not affecting the paper ballots, so if there had been electronic fraud the hand recount would have shown a huge discrepancy with the initial count.

  • I’m becoming more of a fan of LocalFluffs suggestion that votes be counted by actual tokens. Would it really be *that* hard?

  • Xopher

    Military coup, President Trump pulling an autocoup, and secession are now on the table in America.

    That’s what you get for stealing elections, it makes all kinds of stealing power acceptable.

  • wayne

    Mitch-
    Good stuff.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Folks. Why do you think these coldly analytical data science people find it necessary to put background music in their super-science data presentation? This is [deleted] cloaked in data manipulation mumbo jumbo as well as a hodge-podge of earlier charges. As Andrew said, they don’t address the hand recounts that certify the results. It does not fit the oh-so credible “data supported” narrative.

  • Jeff Fauva: I have deleted the obscenity from your comment. One asterisk does not suffice.

    This is a warning. Next time it is a week suspension.

  • Cotour

    If I have 100 bananas that all look similar and am asked to count them over and over, in the end I will always come out with the number 100 bananas.

    If I then give those 100 bananas each to 100 chimps, but was not able in my counting to detect that 3 of those bananas were actually made of wax, then there are going to be 3 very upset chimps. (Have you ever seen an upset chimp? Not pretty)

    There are methods of detecting wax bananas here, but the bananas have all been shredded and that was done to not allow the detection of which of the bananas were the wax bananas.

    Do you, Jeff F, know how angry chimps get when you give them a wax banana and they were expecting a real banana?

    (You can get this)

  • Jeff Fauva wrote: “They don’t address the hand recounts that certify the results”

    You not only clearly spent no time really listening to the testimony, you didn’t even read my post. As I noted, they made it very clear in their testimony that the audits were useless because of this computer fraud.

    [T]hey found that the Dominion system was specifically designed to destroy the original ballot whenever that ballot was reviewed and its vote adjusted or changed by that human. This means that any later audit is worthless, as it cannot go back and compare the original vote with the final software vote.

    As I said, it is like talking to a wall.

  • Cotour

    (Zman, he may actually get the banana analogy, maybe. We wait.)

  • Cotour: I did not comment to change his mind. That is impossible. It is closed so tight not even COVID-19 can get in.

    I commented to show others that close-mindedness, and to illustrate how it makes it entirely impossible for such people to see beyond their noses. They reject information without reading it. They do this all the time, though they try to hide it. Mr. Fauva goofed here badly, and revealed his intellectual dishonesty for us all.

    I just thought it worthwhile to point it out.

  • Andrew_W

    [T]hey found that the Dominion system was specifically designed to destroy the original ballot whenever that ballot was reviewed and its vote adjusted or changed by that human. This means that any later audit is worthless, as it cannot go back and compare the original vote with the final software vote.

    You’re interpreting that as meaning that the Dominion machines physically shred ballot papers. I don’t interpret it that way, and I’ve no doubt that if that was happening we’d all know about it in no uncertain terms, it would make the hand recount impossible.

    I interpret it as meaning that as the original electronic copy of the ballot is written over/deleted, making an electronic audit of the correctness of the humans decision to audit that individual vote impossible.

  • Cotour

    He is either an operative and here to spread disinformation and to foment chaos and confusion, or he is just like so many others that are of a tribe and are willfully blind. Either are possible and each can be dealt with properly, if not him directly him and his activities being revealed for all to see and understand.

    Here is a young blood new Trumpublican communicating what needs to be communicated.

    https://youtu.be/BroXY4Dw740

    This must be the path for all Americans.

  • Andrew_W

    Find me something on the internet that makes it clear that Dominion machines physically shred ballot papers and then print a new replacement. If that were happening there would be uproar, I’d join it.

    What I see is (likely deliberate) ambiguous terminology being leaped on by people with strong confirmation bias

  • Cotour

    There were no wax bananas served to the chimps in this election.

    https://twitter.com/KanekoaTheGreat/status/1345174003653038080?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1345174003653038080%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thegatewaypundit.com%2F2021%2F01%2Fbreaking-another-video-corrupt-election-workers-feeding-ballots-machines-numerous-times%2F

    I beg to differ. And I can guarantee that those handfuls of ballots that are clearly seen being scanned 5 times in this short time are all NOT for Trump. And rational thinking would indicate that it went on all day every day. Just one of the many and growing piles of real world evidence of election fraud, corruption and perversion which will serve its purpose in the electoral meeting in Congress in 4 days.

    Anyone but Trump. Trump must go, and that is exactly why Trump must stay.

  • janyuary

    Cotour … on a lighter note, your post (well said, by the way) reminds me of the perfect Christmas gift for the busy-body relative (mother, sister, aunt, grandmother) with nothing better to do but to interfere in their kids’ lives.

    Give the gift that keeps on giving — a pet monkey! That’ll keep her occupied. You have no idea how close one of my nephews came to doing just that in order to keep his meddlesome well-meaning mom off his back! {^)

  • janyuary

    Mr. Z: “Cotour: I did not comment to change his mind. That is impossible.”

    You are a remarkable breath of fresh air in the world of journalism and discussion. BRAVO for discerning the nut from the shell.

    I expect that many of us frequently hear, “You can’t change people’s minds, you can’t convince them that C19 is a manufactured crisis, don’t even try!”

    They are wrong to presume that the goal is necessarily to change minds. My goal now, out and about in the real world, is to make C19 Faithful feel so self-consciously silly that they will go away and cower at home, while the rest of us can resume going about our business with courage and ZERO reference at all to their selfish, selfish fear.

  • Cotour

    But would you serve your new pet monkey a wax banana? I think not.

    Just because you serve and eat them yourself does not mean that he would also enjoy such fare.

    Are you getting it? Your serving everyone wax bananas and calling them good bananas. And they are not good bananas, they are in fact made of wax. They are not good for you to eat.

    (The wax bananas represent the many forms that false and fraudulent votes were cast in this last presidential election, there is mounting evidence that clearly demonstrates this a fact)

    You can do this.

    (And I am very savvy to your techniques of deescalating, smoothing and attempting to disarming here, you keep on though)

  • janyuary

    I know I know, the discussion isn’t about C19 Faithful as accessories to manslaughter, but about election fraud as an accessory to freedom-slaughter! And Mr. Z wisely makes SUCH an important point to remember, so smart to discern, that “changing minds” is a separate item from helping to open others’ minds to the fact that those who stubbornly cling to wrong, must be exposed, set aside and left behind in order for the rest of us to progress toward liberty and self-ownership in strictly limited government.

  • janyuary

    “And I am very savvy to your techniques of deescalating, smoothing and attempting to disarming here, you keep on though)”

    I overestimated you.

  • Cotour

    Over estimated or underestimated the field is level.

  • Lee Stevenson

    It’s quite sad to see a group of otherwise intelligent minded people fall into a self renforcing echo chamber of denial. All the points linked to can also be.refuted by a quick search…. But of course, apparently not one of you is willing to follow a link that does not agree with your own world views. And Bob… Scott Adams? Really? The guy who thinks “Biden” is 666 encoded? I would rather take my political advice from a Space journalist than a crackpot cartoonist!
    I already can envisage the replies this post is going to generate, but if it makes even one of you step back from your hate and venom for 30 seconds and have a look at the real evidence for widespread voter fraud over there it will have been worth it.

  • Cotour

    There is no hate or venom here.

    Where do you get that from? Reflection?

    What exactly in your estimation is being denied here?

    All will be clarified in 4 days, one way or another.

    (You know it is funny how the Left leaning in our world rail against the unfair nature of life, inequity, unfairness, abuse of power, the lack of “Social Justice”, and what they fail to see is that what they promote, Leftism or a Socialist model as the solutions to those conditions are in fact what is used as methods of control and are amplified by those on the Left who become empowered. To allow ones self think in such a childish manner is, in a word, childish)

    If individual freedom, respect, opportunity, private property, wealth and equitably counteracting the many abuses of governance is the goal, what the Left among us propose is exactly what you do not want. All that will be brought down on all is the abuse of power, the loss of personal freedom and inequality times 10.

    A simple minded solution to the ills of the world.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert:

    Are they saying that the voting machine scans the paper ballot, and then replaces the scanned image with a new image, destroying the old image? That makes zero sense.

  • Shaun Karry

    Cotour,

    I’m curious about your walk of life. I’ve always wondered who you are as a real person. I don’t expect an answer but I wonder… Are you a politician? A plumber? A Mason? A teacher? An engineer? A pilot? A janitor? I have no idea. Maybe you’ve addressed this in the past? I only ask as having no idea who a person is makes it hard to take their comments seriously. I don’t say this to be rude or accusatory. I simply wish to know the person who’s comments I’m reading time after time. I don’t necessarily disagree (and don’t always agree), but knowing where a person is coming from goes a long way towards acceptance.

  • Shaun Karry

    To expand on this, I’m an Aerospace engineer for Honeywell Aerospace. I have nothing to hide. I have no social media presenence asside from LinkedIn and this comments thread. You can look me up any time. Who are you?

  • Shaun

    *presence

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert:

    I don’t need to hear the full report to know it’s bunk. Let’s take the following assertion from the report:

    “In 94 precincts in Dekalb County, it is statistically impossible to have 9 out of 10 voters voting for Joe Biden”

    Can you think of aaaanything at all that might challenge that assertion? I wonder how many of these precincts voted over 90% for Hillary in 2016? The answer is 84. (over 100 Dekalb precincts voted +85% for Hillary) So 10 more precincts out of 193 in Dekalb voted over 90% for Joe Biden. Not such a stretch now, is it? Why would I entertain anymore of this report with obvious fraudulent assertions?

    Who’s close-minded now?

  • Shaun Karry

    Auto correct is a bummer…

  • Cotour

    Shaun Karry: (You gave me a good laugh :)

    If you have taken the time to read what I have to say I would think you would have a good idea and understand who I am and what I think.

    Agree? Disagree? I have said before that writing here on BTB is a kind of therapy for me as well as a writing exercise.

    I am just a guy, I have many interests, I am an American, a businessman, I consider myself a patriot, someone who understands the core of the intent of the Constitution, someone who attempts to share, confront, educate, enrage in the attempt to revealing some degree of truth.

    I think you know who I am.

  • Jeff Fauva wrote: “I don’t need to hear the full report to know it’s bunk.”

    Like I said, like talking to a wall.

  • Robert Pratt

    To Andrew_W’s post: “I didn’t see anything there that addressed the hand recount, all these claimed irregularities would only affect the electronic count, not affecting the paper ballots, so if there had been electronic fraud the hand recount would have shown a huge discrepancy with the initial count.”

    Others have posted good responses. I wish to add this:

    I have run elections, chaired committees to test and buy election equipment, and worked intimately with elections using the old computer punch card system (hanging chads); standard paper all hand counted ballots; hand voted ballots that machines then scanned at a central count location (color in the oval), and; the latest no-paper involved Hart-Intercivic systems.

    When we used scanned ballots, teams stacked and oriented ballots before scanning. We also looked for marks outside the ovals or multiple marks in a single race among other things. When we found errant or unclear marks, we attempted to determine voter intent. If such was easy to do (which it often was) we physically erased errant pencil marks and/or added to oval marking to “cure” or correct the ballot before submitting for scanning.

    This was done on the original ballot. If we did not have watchers or bipartisan teams in the activity there would be no way to detect the changes at a later recount. You might detect slight erasure but you would not be able to know that the ballot review team did such or the original voter.

    When using the punch card system, in my jurisdiction as a precinct election judge we had access to the submitted ballots and several times in the day stacked and oriented such in a case so that when taken to the central count location at our courthouse cards would be ready to insert into the card reader. Funny, because computers wowed people and the punch card was without anything but the punch location, many believed there was no way to cheat these ballots. However, as a computer industry guy who knew all about punch cards, it was easy to determine the card location of each race and if I had been dishonest I could have easily spoiled ballots by punching out another selection in a race voted thereby creating no-vote, or I could have voted for the voter in under vote races. I was amazed that others didn’t realize how easy it was, they were simply too ignorant to understand how simple it was.

    All of these systems work differently and various jurisdictions have different rules and procedures. From my experience, more robust than most commenting, there are certainly ways to change the ballots to where they would match the machine count but be fraudulent in systems where ballots are scanned by staff at polling locations or a central count station.

    Like all systems, the integrity of the system depends upon the integrity of the high level users.

    Just my two cents.

  • Cotour

    The word bunk, in what context do you mean it?

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bunk

    I do not see where the word “Bunk” is appropriate related to the issue of election fraud. Can you be more specific?

  • Shaun Karry

    Contour,

    Perfect non-answer. I respect your right to remain anonymous though. Cheers.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert:

    The internet is a big place with lots of information. One needs to filter-out the nonsense.. You should try it instead of allowing your head to be spillover with partisan cacophony. My point stands.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert Pratt:

    Thanks for your insight. Can you provide comment on GA’s recount and audit system? I’d be curious to hear from someone with experience.

    It seems that most of the election fraud allegations here depend on large-scale fraud on election night, as well as during the recounts/audit.

  • Cotour

    Jeff F:

    What do you make of the Pennsylvania legislature rejecting their own electors? 150 Congresspersons and at least 11 Senators will object.

    What do you make of that?

    These many Pennsylvania legislators specifically are in a conspiracy to perpetrate a fraud even though they know there is nothing to object to?

    Now that would be some extreme politics and if true would spell the end of our country IMO. Both these state and Federal Congresspersons and Senators would NEVER go where they say they are going to go, not without irrefutable evidence that they were absolutely confident in of fraud and wrong doing. At a level that would have changed the result of the election.

    What do you make of it all?

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert:

    Instead of repeating yourself, answer this directly:

    – Is it ‘statistically impossible” for 94 precincts in Dekalb to vote over 90% for Joe Biden, given that 84 precincts voted for Hillary in 2016?

    Or is a wall too smart for you?

  • wayne

    Lee–
    “Crackpot cartoonist.”….. you’re thinking of Gary (“Doonesbury”) Trudeau.

  • wayne

    Jordan Peterson / Friedrich Nietzsche / Akira the Don
    “Tarantulas 🕷️”
    https://youtu.be/7zIkUkRLJAM
    7:59

    “When they call themselves the good and the just, do not forget that they would be Pharisees… if only they had – power!

  • mpthompson

    Instead of repeating yourself, answer this directly:

    – Is it ‘statistically impossible” for 94 precincts in Dekalb to vote over 90% for Joe Biden, given that 84 precincts voted for Hillary in 2016?

    It depends, you are actually asking multiple questions here. Whether it is believable that 94 precincts voted for Biden in Dekalb county where 84 precincts went for Hillary is one question. Whether it is believable in that count 90% for Joe Biden (presumably ~10% for Trump) is an entirely different question. For a large number of precincts in a swing state, which is specifically called a “swing” state because the population is close to a 50%/50% for both parties, to go 90% for one candidate is indeed extremely odd indeed. Even in San Francisco, the deepest blue area in a very blue state, Trump did better than 10% of the vote in 2020.

    Statistically, nothing is impossible. It is within the realm of possibility Biden got every single vote in Dekalb county. However, it would be extremely unlikely. It’s just a little less unlikely that he got 90% of the vote. Such statistics are circumstantial evidence. It may not be the smoking gun that definitively proves cheating took place, but it certainly is an odd enough statistical outlier to warrant scrutiny as to whether ballot stuffing did indeed occur using more direct forensic methods.

    Besides, the major piece of evidence from the witness testimony in Georgia is this specific, simple assertion. The process of voting tabulation is “tabulation” — any system that counts and logs votes for candidates over any specific span of time should always report either zero or an increasing number of votes for a candidate over that span of time. However, an examination of the logs from the voting systems in Georgia indicates that during certain spans of time, Trump received a negative number of votes and Biden received a corresponding amount of positive votes in addition to the votes already logged for Biden. According to the witnesses, in a tabulation system, this should never occur and they cannot think of any rational reason why logs in a tabulation system would indicate such a movement in votes should take place. To a rational person, this is extremely odd and merits further investigation as to what data input or logic within the system could explain such tabulation behavior.

    Perhaps, there is a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. If so, let’s figure it out. Does it point to an odd characteristic of the vote tabulation system where tabulation results over a span of time for a candidate can indeed be negative? This would be surprising but could be a possibility. Or, are the logs not an accurate representation of the actual tabulation process and there actually is no “negative vote” anomaly? If this is the case, why can’t the logs be trusted to reflect the tabulation process? Or, does this anomaly point to the tabulation system logic is operating in such a way that votes are shifted from one candidate to another.

    If ballots and the voting system software/records are properly preserved, this shouldn’t be difficult to get to the bottom of. However, dismissing it away as absurd is irrational (or dishonest) if one is really earnest about getting to the truth of what happened in Georgia.

  • wayne

    Gangs of New York
    “Election day”
    https://youtu.be/dg8E6AEeVtI
    0:40

  • Jeff Fauva

    mpthompson: Thanks for the response. With regard to the statistical analysis:

    “Statistically, nothing is impossible. It is within the realm of possibility Biden got every single vote in Dekalb county. However, it would be extremely unlikely. It’s just a little less unlikely that he got 90% of the vote. Such statistics are circumstantial evidence.”

    Biden did not get 90% of the vote in Dekalb county – he got 83%. I suspect this is why this ‘data science’ presentation cherry-picked *precinct* level results rather than county results.

    https://www.dekalbcountyga.gov/sites/default/files/ElectionSummaryReportRPT-Official%20and%20Complete%2011.03.2020.pdf

    Some counties/precincts vote consistently in the 90% range for one party – this is not new or surprising.

  • Jeff Fauva

    mpthompson: Just to be as clear:

    – 94 Dekalb precincts voted 90% for Biden in 2020
    – 83 Dekalb precincts voted 90% for Hillary in 2016 (revised from 84 precincts – one precinct is 89.9 for Hillary)

    My point is simply that it is not at all striking that 10 or 11 more precincts tipped-over the 90% mark for Biden – particularly when well over 100 precincts voted 85% or more for Hillary in 2016. I don’t see how this meets even the low bar of circumstantial evidence.

  • mpthompson

    mpthompson: Thanks for the response

    My point is simply that it is not at all striking that 10 or 11 more precincts tipped-over the 90% mark for Biden

    I don’t live in Georgia and can’t really draw a conclusion myself that Biden hitting the 90% mark across a large number of precincts is unusual or not. I believe it would be suspect in a swing state, but perhaps not. I’ll let people from Georgia draw their own conclusions.

    What is your response to testimony that there were specific periods of time in the official tabulation reporting by multiple Georgia counties where Trump received a negative tabulation count (ie. his vote totals decreased) and Biden appears to have received a corresponding boost? The testimony indicates that this can’t be attributed to human entry errors (such as inadvertent swapping of hand entered spreadsheet cells that are later corrected) because nowhere are humans manually entering data into the system after the vote is collected at the ballot box. Rather, data and ballot images are gathered by machine, placed onto SD cards, the SD cards carried (by humans) to central processing location and the SD cards directly entered into the tabulation system for counting. There is nowhere in this chain where official numbers as reported by counties have indicated a decreasing number for any candidate. Yet, this occurred on multiple occasions in multiple counties in both official county data feeds which were logged and in press feeds including those reported New York Times on election night (presumably the press feeds echoed the official county tabulation feeds). Furthermore, where negative results were reported to be shifted from one candidate to the other, it was always from Trump to Biden.

    What is described by the testimony are logs from official sources in specific counties showing at specific times where shifts of specific vote numbers from Trump to Biden occurred. This claim by its nature is much different than the claims you are focussing on which are conceivably waved away by saying “Well, some counties always vote overwhelmingly for the Democrats, nothing special happened”.

    As far as I know, the following two features of the specific claims of suspicious shifts in votes haven’t yet been explained:

    1. Did the shift in votes from one candidate to another as reported by the official tabulation logs (and in the press feeds) for three Georgia counties really occur at the times indicated? This should be easy for an objective third party to confirm or refute as the data is either there as described or it isn’t.

    2. Then, if the logs are an accurate reflection of the tabulation process, what is a reasonable explanation for the tabulations to ever show a decrementing count for one candidate and the same count being shifted to the other candidate?

    And I’ll add a third question, which I didn’t hear covered in the testimony. Why didn’t a later hand recount uncover such large discrepancies for the counties in question? For this, I suspect the recounts, although called a hand count by the Georgia SoS, in these counties were simply running the stored data on the SD cards through the same system. I don’t see how ballot images recorded on an SD card can be recounted by hand. I really would like to know the details of the recounts that did occur and whether they indeed would uncover discrepancies of the nature described above.

    I’m not saying there isn’t a perfectly prosaic explanation why the logs may indicate vote shifts occurred but didn’t actually happen. I’m rather pointing out that I haven’t yet seen a reasonable explanation. And to simply try to wave away such an anomaly, that sounds a whole lot like fraud, without explanation is wholly unsatisfactory to a very large number of people in this country.

  • jimena smith

    the justice system is also in the hands of the marxist-globalist dem-rino swamp CROOKS. A mountain of evidence that no court will ever hear – they are comfortable and confident that they are beyond the reach of the law. They are happy servants of the red-chinese, who fill their bank accounts in return. Marxist-crooks, and globalist-greedy crooks.

  • mpthompson

    The longer credible claims by Republicans of fraud are ignored by the government and courts and not fully investigated with the same vigor past claims by Democrats have been investigated, the more people will come to believe:

    Biden had more votes, but Trump had more voters.

  • Andrew_W

    The longer credible claims by Republicans of fraud are ignored by the government and courts and not fully investigated with the same vigor past claims by Democrats have been investigated, the more people will come to believe:

    Seriously?
    This has been by far the most investigated election in US history. The plaintiffs are just refusing to accept the judges rulings (Speaking figuratively and literally), and with all plaintiffs in that situation they’re insisting the rulings are from a bent or incompetent judges. People are too deeply committed to face the facts that their cases have been very weak, they’re just buying the narrative of corruption, sticking together, and running with their team on it.

  • Cotour

    “This has been by far the most investigated election in US history. The plaintiffs are just refusing to accept the judges rulings”

    Again, where are these investigations that these judges have undertaken and who undertook them for them?

    (No judge has done ANY investigations into ANY of the alleged election / voter fraud. The judges dismissed all the cases to date based mostly in a standing argument. And they have pushed it along to where it belongs, in the Congress to be sorted out)

    You can not have it both ways.

  • Questioner

    Here is a meanwhile very popular video on how communist infiltration and decomposition work in reality. For those who don’t know. A former KGB agent explains the procedure in detail. Perhaps you recognize the processes described in the current situation in the liberal western states.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9TviIuXPSE

  • Edward

    jimena smith wrote: “the justice system is also in the hands of the marxist-globalist dem-rino swamp CROOKS.

    This bias in the courts is why the Democrats finally no longer care whether they get caught pulling off a fraudulent election. No one will do anything about it. Success is assured. And look where we are.

  • mpthompson

    No judge has done ANY investigations into ANY of the alleged election / voter fraud.

    ^^^^ This ^^^^

    Not one single court case reached the point where evidence and sworn depositions were presented in court. Not one. Every single case was dismissed outright due to standing, latches, or whatever other reason fancied the judges. It’s easy to claim when that no proof exists when every opportunity is denied to even present evidence that may reach the legal threshold of proof.

    BTW, I’m still waiting to hear a counter to very detailed claims that official tabulation logs from multiple Georgia counties show anomalous activity with regards to votes being switched.

  • Jeff Fauva

    mpthompson: I’d like to nail-down this one point before moving on to any others.

    “I don’t live in Georgia and can’t really draw a conclusion myself that Biden hitting the 90% mark across a large number of precincts is unusual or not. I believe it would be suspect in a swing state, but perhaps not. I’ll let people from Georgia draw their own conclusions.”

    Gee, don’t go too far out on a limb there. Can you at the very least offer an opinion about this statement? Put more plainly:

    “Is it surprising that some precincts with a history of voting 90% for Democrats continued to vote 90% for Democrats in 2020?”

    Would you be willing to concede the point if I found any precincts that voted 90% for Trump? The larger point is that these are supposed to be data scientists – why weaken their presentation with such an obvious and easily debunked assertion?

    Thanks for the responses. Perhaps Robert is afraid my wall will break-down his.

  • Robert Pratt

    To Jeff Fauva on his post: “Thanks for your insight. Can you provide comment on GA’s recount and audit system? I’d be curious to hear from someone with experience.”

    No I cannot because I am not intimately familiar with the system used there. However I can say that in all the systems, excepting the no paper ballot system, I have worked with, cheating the original ballots is not hard at all if you do not have integrity or, for those without, people watching to assure it does not happen. I’ve been at this a lifetime and ballot box stuffing has been around in a huge way for seemingly ever. LBJ did a lot of it in Texas to steal a Senate election over other Democrats.

    As to all the posts saying “statistically impossible,” it would work better for you to say “statistically improbable.” Outliers do happen and it is fundamentally wrong in most cases to claim impossibility.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Robert Pratt – Thanks for the thoughts. I don’t think anyone is arguing that it is impossible to commit fraud to change votes, just that Trump’s team can’t produce evidence of fraud that any court finds credible.

    I agree that the “statistically impossible” claim is wrong. I would be willing to overlook that as careless phrasing from a layperson. However, the folks who generated the video at the top of this post claim to be data scientists – they clearly know better. If their work is that sloppy, I don’t care to see it. If they know full well what they are saying and put it in anyway, they are trying to manipulate the viewer.

  • Cotour

    Jeff F, Jeff efing himself: “Trump’s team can’t produce evidence of fraud that any court finds credible.”

    That would be true if a court had actually chosen to examine any evidence before not hearing any of the cases filed. You can not find what you do not look for. What you propose is logically impossible but you propose that it is. You may come to understand this at some point.

    But do you know who will apparently be hearing actual evidence on the subject of election fraud in the proper forum that convene to hear such things and resolve them? This is specifically related to presidential elections. I have pointed this out to you before Jeff, do you know the answer yet?

  • Alton

    Dekalb County is like the Space Shuttle on launch whitch was GO at Power- up; running at 104% of rated power………
    Just like the 2012 election where 103 precincts in NYC, Pittsburgh, Philadelphia, and Chicago had more votes for Obama than registered voters.
    But they all counted!

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour

    The idea that courts have avoided hearing these cases and avoided the evidence is simply a false and bad faith argument. Below are just a few quotes directly from the Nevada ruling: (dismissed with prejudice – just one of many such rulings)

    https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/20420186/order-granting-motion-to-dismiss-statement-of-contest-1.pdf

    “Contestants did not prove under any standard of proof that the Agilis machine malfunctioned in a manner sufficient to raise reasonable doubt as to the outcome of the election.

    Contestants did not prove under any standard of proof that any of Nevada’s election officials committed malfeasance.

    Contestants did not prove under any standard of proof that the persons witnessed by Doe 3 had an agency relationship with Defendants or the Biden-Harris Campaign, or otherwise acted on the behalf of, either directly or indirectly, Defendants or the Biden-Harris campaign.

    Contestants did not prove under any standard of proof that the persons witnessed by Doe 3 gave or offered to give to any person anything of value for the purpose of manipulating or altering the outcome of the election.

    ..did not prove under any standard of proof that illegal votes were cast and counted, or legal votes were not counted at all, due to voter fraud, nor…in an amount sufficient to raise reasonable doubt as to the outcome of the election,”

    There are 7-8 pages ruling on claims and evidence found to not meet standards of proof – read if you dare.

  • Questioner

    Mike Lindell FILPS Georgia!

    Alanna Ortiz: MIKE L. HIRED PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSVJDp9aW5I

  • Cotour

    Jeff F: This will all be put to bed beginning tomorrow.

    I still propose that no judge or court wants any part of this controversy for the reasons that I have previously listed and if they have examined any evidence they willfully refuse to see what has become plainer and plainer at least to me and many others.

    So either I am delusional or you are, we wait to see who wins this contest.

    (And being delusional is a common paradoxical condition when you apply logic to politics)

  • Questioner

    Jovan Pulitzer Responds to GA Voting Bombshell

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evp_eUpghXg

  • Questioner

    Cotour:

    This was just released by Lin Wood and it’s quite shocking. How is this to be interpreted?

    Lin Wood@LLinWood: Answer is YES.

    Paul Ryan @SpeakerRyan & Mike Pence @VP @Mike_Pence have been conspiring against @realDonaldTrump since 2016 to defeat President in 2020.

    These 2 traitors to We The People actually think Pence/Ryan will win 2024.

    Let them know what you think about their plans.

    https://publish.twitter.com/?query=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FLLinWood%2Fstatus%2F1346538752102064128&widget=Tweet

  • Cotour

    Questioner:

    Paul Ryan may be very attractive to corporate America and his fellow RINO’s, but I think that I can guarantee you that in a legit election he will never become president or vice president. Not with the emergence of the Trumpublican party anyway.

    And if Mike Pence abandons the president his political career will be over at that moment that that is detected.

    Now the people that make and sell these several voting systems may disagree with my take, and if this situation is not properly addressed there will be no need to vote in the future anyway. At that point it will only be symbolic and we will all be owned.

    Here is what Jim Jordan has to say on the coming Greatest Show On Earth.

    https://youtu.be/gF0ps5DAuAY

  • Jeff Fauva

    Some folks on this board:

    “The courts can’t resolve election disputes and are corrupt”
    “The US election system is hopelessly corrupt”
    “GOP politicians are hopelessly corrupt”

    The same folks on this board:

    “USA! USA! USA!”

    We are a great country built on a foundation of third-world corruption – that’s your worldview.

  • Cotour

    A majority of Pennsylvania legislators send letter to congress, guess what they tell Congress?

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/12/breaking-76-141-republican-representatives-pa-send-letter-congress-asking-reject-states-20-electors/

    This, Jeff F does not just happen as a result at this level because of partisan politics.

    And it begins.

  • Cotour

    To be clear that is a majority of Republican legislators in Pennsylvania that sent the letter to the Congress requesting they not accept the electors.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour: Thanks for the important clarification

    “This, Jeff F does not just happen as a result at this level because of partisan politics.”

    “To be clear that is a majority of Republican legislators in Pennsylvania that sent the letter to the Congress requesting they not accept the electors.”

    C’mon now.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour:

    “Jeff F: This will all be put to bed beginning tomorrow.”

    By who? Not sure what this means – that Pence will negate the election? That’s not a thing.

  • Cotour

    Partisan politics happens, its the nature of politics.

    BUT, for 140+ U.S. Congresspersons and 12+ U.S. Senators as well, and the many state Congresspersons and Senators who have access to the evidence related to the 2020 presidential election given to them in formal hearings would NEVER go where they have gone if there was no there there. NEVER, NEVER, EVER. That is beyond partisan if there was no credible evidence to support their choice to protest.

    Now that would be a true Constitutional crisis and I would have no part of such partisan action and I would say it plainly here and in the other places that I give and people seek my opinion on this and several other subjects. NEVER.

    And so that being said and agreed upon the conclusion that must be arrived at is that their protestations are in fact a result of their concern that there had been an extreme degree of fraud and cheating done specifically by the very well organized Democrat party. And that organized effort was executed in these several crucial states to a degree that indeed influenced the result of the election. And that evidence will hopefully be revealed in an organized and rational manner, forced if necessary, for all Americans to see and understand.

    And if that does not happen, even if Biden is proclaimed the winner in the end, then we all are in jeopardy. The end result of that will be true apathy and no faith in any election. Why would anyone vote in the future if it is understood that the results are “Shaped” using several techniques and technologies as others deem appropriate? WHY? And I suspect that several other elections leading up to this 2020 election were also “Shaped” throughout the country.

    And thinking about it maybe that is the desired end result, mass apathy through destroying trust in the vote in which the Democrats, the Socialists, the Marxists among us will dominate in perpetuity. And that in the end is the Democrat end goal IMO, and that is the introduction to true Constitutional crisis and an entre into a violent and or chaotic America in order to right the country.

    If Socialism is formally embraced to the point where the government takes an even larger roll in my and other lives, you will deserve that condition not me and the many others who find that offensive and tyrannical. That is not America as I understand America.

  • Cotour

    And I reiterate, take note, Jeff F and others:

    TODAY IS THE FORMAL DAY THAT THE TRUMPUBLICAN PARTY FORMS AND IT WILL TAKE OVER THE CONTROL OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

    Take note.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour:

    I agree that the Trumpalo party begins today. I think only Trump voters are losing faith in the voting system, because Trump and his media enablers are promoting that view. It may be borne-out in the runoff results from GA.

    The question is, how many GOP members are driven over to the Dems or become independents? The harassment of Romney and other formerly respectable GOPers – they may have no other place to go.

  • Questioner

    Pence Confirms 3 Paths Victory!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3BOzjLcUbM

  • Cotour

    “The question is, how many GOP members are driven over to the Dems or become independents? ”

    ZERO. Democrat Vernon Jones, rejects the Democrat party and joins the Republican party.

    https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/bryan-preston/2021/01/06/scoop-black-georgia-democrat-state-rep-vernon-jones-switches-parties-n1310028

    So your faith in the voting system given the mass of evidence that exists regarding fraud and technological manipulation does not for one second give you pause? Its all just political handlers and their PR manipulations? Nothing to see here? You keep believing that.

    The GA Senate run off was either won or lost 6 weeks ago when the Republican candidates refused to state plainly in the GA vote fraud controversy, “I have seen enough evidence that satisfies me that this presidential election needs more scrutiny and I stand with president Trump”. Thats all they had to do and they both would have won comfortably.

    But they listened to their lawyers and their consultants, who by the way are self interested political operative who do not IMO have their candidates best interests when they give their advice. They are all discounting their advice and council in order that they have employment no matter who wins.

    And that is why Trump is so successful, he pays little to no attention to such operatives. And the people see and interpret that as being real. And that in the world of politics is worth a tons of gold and donations.

  • Cotour

    I just found this massive compilation of the evidence of fraud in the 2020 presidential election that the many legislators have been able to see and understand:

    https://got-freedom.org/evidence/

    You brows through this, it will take you a while but let us know what your conclusion is afterwards, Jeff F.

  • Cotour

    And I think we can all now see where this runoff election in GA will be going:

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/01/election-fraud-32400-votes-removed-senator-perdues-vote-tally-live-tv/

    Perdue is a big backer of the presidents cause NOW!

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour:

    “Its all just political handlers and their PR manipulations?”

    I didn’t matter whether Trump lost by 7 million votes or 30 million votes – he was always going to call it a rigged election. He called 2016 rigged – until he won it. You of all people should understand Trump’s modus operandi – if the judgment or election is for me, we are a nation of laws! If the judgment is against me, BIAS! UNFAIR! RIGGED! He will get on whatever side of any issue that he thinks benefits him.

    We’ve seen it over and over again – how can anyone take it seriously at this point? Most folks get it, and see the post-election rallies and thugs taking to the streets, and are alarmed and more alienated from Trumpism.

    Trump will continue to milk his diehard fans for every cent they are worth – there will be rallies when Biden takes office, more rallies, more golf, rallies, golf, rallies, golf… until the crowds taper-off and dwindle. Then he’ll have to put his name on something else – whiskey is hip again, maybe Trump Barrell Aged Scottish Whiskey or some such mess.

    The GOP sees weakness now – they are looking for a way out. Trump sees destruction – he’s looking to punish anyone in the GOP insufficiently obsequious. Where are those cast out of the Trumpalo party to go?

  • Cotour

    Note: The Congress has just retired to debate the objection to the Arizona electoral votes. And that apparently will continue after every state and the objections to their electoral votes. Will I assume go on all day or longer.

    As to Trump selectively not accepting the vote, this process underway is supporting the facts that the election has indeed been compromised. Arizona electors objected to by Arizona’s own Senator.

    And you miss my point: ALL of these consultants and assistants to every and all politicos do not IMO give their best strategic advise because they have their own long term interests in mind.

  • Cotour

    And their allegiance lies with the party’s and the political machine in the long term and not individual politicians who come and go. And they want and need Trump to go. Trump threatens ALL of that.

    Trump must go, and that is why Trump must stay.

  • Jeff Fauva

    Cotour:

    “As to Trump selectively not accepting the vote, this process underway is supporting the facts that the election has indeed been compromised.”

    It makes no difference whether Trump ‘selectively’ accepts or does not accept the election results. Why even have elections if the incumbent can just say, “Nah, I select staying in office.”

    I’ve noticed this has seeped into the Trumpalo bloodstream around the country – GOP trying to avoid seating duly elected Democrats. This leads down a path where the end result is elections ‘won’ by whomever is left standing on the rubble. Peaceful transitions of power are now just another norm shattered by Trumpism.

    Again, normal folks who don’t storm the Capitol building are aghast – this will continue to build antipathy toward Trumpism.

  • Questioner

    REAKING! Pence REFUSES to REJECT ELECTORS as Protestors STORM Capitol Building!!!

    Cotour: Please comment! Thank you.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED42lKKH490

  • Cotour

    Jeff F: Its the Congress who says who the president will be.

    As to the protests, they are passionate protestors and I understand their passion. But passion is not the sole issue that determines who the president is. There are valid controversies here, and again, its the Congresses job to sort it out.

    Questioner: I do not really disagree with Pence to be honest. Listening to all of this I have not become aware of where the Constitution says that he has the ability to be the ultimate judge here. But that may just be an issue of interpretation.

    Again, it is Congresses job to sort all this out, and they are in the process of doing so. And that is what the Constitution proscribes.

  • Questioner

    Cotour: Why is Trump, as a true leader, not on the side of the Protestants in or at the Capitol?

  • Questioner

    Lin Wood: Pence is in fact a TRAITOR. I have the evidence & have interviewed the whistleblower.

    https://publish.twitter.com/?query=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FLLinWood%2Fstatus%2F1346921282953224193&widget=Tweet

  • Questioner

    Lin Wood:

    “Lock up Traitor Mike Pence @Mike_Pence , Mr. President. Lock him up.
    He conspired with @RodRosenstein to overthrow our government.
    Lock up Rosenstein. He also directed the murder of Seth Rich plus many other crimes.”

    https://publish.twitter.com/?query=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FLLinWood%2Fstatus%2F1346908811316129792&widget=Tweet

  • Cotour

    I do not see where the vice president is empowered to CHOOSE the state electoral votes, the vice president appears empowered to COUNT the states electoral votes and reveal those results. The power to choose the president is the sole responsibility of the “Representatives”. The word, “Representative”, meaning Congresspersons or Senators is mentioned 5 times in this related clause by the authors. Open to interpretation? Ask a lawyer, seems pretty cut and dried to me.

    Can the various states legislatures recall their electoral votes after they find out there was substantial questionable election results? And then they resubmit them?

    Can the Representatives who are empowered to choose the president proscribe a 10 day investigation of the various questionable election results in those many states?

    I would think that when the Congresspersons and Senators from the various states in question are willing to object to the presented electors as well as many in their own state legislatures that that would be a point where a different solution needs to be crafted by the representatives charged with choosing the president.

    And here we are, figure it out representatives.

    Section 11, clause 111:

    The President of the Senate opens all the States’ certificates in front of the Representatives and Senators, and then the votes are counted.

    The person with the majority of electors’ votes will be the President.

    If more than one person has the same number of electors’ votes, the Representatives will immediately choose one of them by a vote.

    If nobody has a majority, then the Representatives will choose a President from among the five people who got the most electors’ votes.

    But if the Representatives have to choose a President like this, the vote will be taken by States, and each state has only one vote.

    At least two-thirds of the Representatives must be present to choose a President like this. If the President has to be chosen like this, the person with the next most electors’ votes will be the Vice President.

    If there is a tie, the Senators vote for the Vice President. [The 12th Amendment and the 23rd Amendment changed this process]

  • Questioner

    Cotour:

    Donald Trump and Lin Wood don’t seem to agree with you about Pence’s possibilities in this process!

  • Cotour

    I just can not see in the text where they get that.

    Show it to me Lin Wood.

    Remember, Lin Wood is a lawyer and will argue just for arguments sake until you give up. That is a strategy. And Trump needs Pence on his side, but the text does not appear to support his position IMO.

    This may be where it comes from, and Georgia was at the core of that controversy in 1800:

    “Did Thomas Jefferson, as president of the Senate, ignore irregularities in—and possible skulduggery behind—Georgia’s electoral ballot in order to eliminate his Federalist opponents from contention? Newspapers of the day reported that Georgia’s ballot was defective, and tales of Jefferson’s unusual behavior during the vote count echoed through the nineteenth century. But by the twentieth century the rumors and allegations had been completely forgotten, and the legions of Jefferson scholars and biographers had moved on to Sally Hemings and other things.”

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2004/03/how-jefferson-counted-himself-in/302888/

    I do agree that a state and its legislature should have the ability to resubmit what is agreed in the state legislature are spoiled or faulty electors due to fraud and or corruption. And the vice president may well be involved with getting those electors properly straightened out and accomplished and that can fall within his responsibilities in properly counting.

    You could probably make a reasonable argument for the vice president doing so if you were going to go past the single word “Counting” and its intent. But Pence is not apparently willing to go there.

  • Cotour

    Yes, Andrew W, you were wrong.

    https://youtu.be/60TLCfN1mWM

  • Questioner

    Cotour:

    That little Republican “uprising” in Congress was nothing more than a storm in a water glass, or in other words nothing but the creation of hot air. It turns out once again that so-called conservatives cannot recognize a genuine Marxist threat, let alone combat it effectively. Then there is the corruption that is caused by the political system of the professional politician himself.

    Why still take into account small formal questions (there were also at least two views), such as whether Pence has the right to certain actions or not, when it comes to not only save America but the whole of the West before the final takeover by the cultural-Marxist globalists. If there was a God, he left Pence yesterday. It turns out that Lin Wood was right. Pence speculates on the continuation of his career without Trump.

    To put an end to communism, other right-wing opponents and methods are required. I could imagine how. Well, let’s leave that.

  • Andrew_W

    Cotour, Matt Gaetz said: ” If anybody had been hurt today it would have been even more of a catastrophe than we already saw”
    Tragically Ashli Babbitt was killed.
    Is that what you were referring to? I don’t understand, I’m not Matt Gaetz. But thanks.

  • pzatchok

    I would like to know why she was chosen to die.

    What did she do that forced one out of a thousand policemen to shoot just her.

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